ABS After Singling

7/28/2015

ABS After Singling

how to fix it fast

davelinde
26 June 2010
08:51 PM
So, I have an 01 Volvo 660 that was singled 3 years ago by the previous owner.  It's an awesome truck, in awesome shape, but the ABS were not corrected after singling so it throws a warning on startup and doesn't operate the ABS.  I had done some investigating on this and assumed I could fix it when I got the truck.  If I've understood my options correctly they are as following:

1. Depending on the specific ABS controller it may be possible to reprogram it?

2. I can replace the ABS controller with one that will deal with four, not six wheel locations.

3. I can get some senders and mount them in parallel with the existing senders on the remaining axle and fake out the controller.

At this point I want to get the ABS working before my first trip at the end of July.  I was initially not so concerned, but yesterday I took the truck out on some back roads to see how it handled and I found out fast that (at least bobtail) it takes nothing to lock up the rear wheels.  I told my wife (who had followed me home on the trip to pick it up) and she said, oh yeah, I saw you smoke a tire at one of the exits and meant to ask you why you did that (dah, it was not on purpose and I didn't even know I'd locked one up and smoked it).  Then, to top it off (now that I have an HDT) my neighbor comes by to tell me he used to drive a truck like mine (who knew?) and somehow the ABS came up and he was pretty adamant I shouldn't drive it until I fix it.  Though, of course, the truck has been around the country and driven this way several years?  But I digress...

So I crawled under the truck and cannot even find the rascal that needs adjusting to see how hard it might be to R&R (and figure out what exact device I've got and what exact device might replace it).  I also discerned that the "easy" option 3 above must involve removing all four wheels on the back axle.  I never
thought I'd say I'm not able to change a tire, but yikes these look big and heavy - so I'm not inclined to pull them off just to see if I can rig something (though I'm open to suggestions and encouragement).

So I'm looking for advice and some pointers here.  What have others done? How do I find out what device I've got?  Maybe I'll just pay a shop to knock this out for me?  What should I tell them?  I just located two HDT shops very near my house and plan to drop by each to see what they work on and what they know.  Looking for ideas here.

Rif
26 June 2010
09:08 PM
Dave,
I just finished this fix on my 2000 770.  I had been driving it for 5 years with no ABS and one quick bobtail stop while coming around a corner and finding traffic stopped ahead convinced me it was time to deal with it.  I went the
new controller route.  Below is the link to that discussion.
marvmarcy
26 June 2010
10:30 PM
For those singling or with singled trucks, you can ignore my comments.  For those still looking for the right truck, I highly recommend a factory single axle rig to avoid the cost of singling and frustrations/expense of trying to make
a singled truck brake properly.  Also, the factory single axles are 23K rated, vs. 20K on singled axles.  JMHO

I know factory single trucks are much harder to find, especially equipped the way you want.  So I recognize both sides of this issue.

L'iil Black Dog
26 June 2010
10:53 PM
Marvmercy
This seems to be a Volvo only related problem, so I do not see the association with going the factory single route?
Just my 2 cents.
Curt
Scrap
26 June 2010
11:28 PM
I guess a lot of it depends if you even have the sensors and extra modulators on the rear.  If there isn't a wire tied to the camshaft tube then there isn't a sensor in there.  The wheel and hub will have to come off no matter what you do.  So I guess the shop decision is easy in that case.  If there is a wire then I guess you are back to the same decision again.  If there are two extra modulators on there that are plumbed to nothing then bonus you just saved some $.  If there isn't then the price of two of those would probably eat up half of what a new 4S controller costs.  Your neighbor is right for commercial use.  ABS light is part of the inspection now.

Curt
It is a 6S/6M thing.  Every USXpress truck has it no matter what brand it is. Volvo, however, must have something different going on in that you can stuff two sensors on one wheel.  You'd have to weld on a 2nd bung to do that with other brand trucks.  I can't see a shop doing the 2 sensor thing, but maybe.

Dan Freedman
26 June 2010
11:53 PM
Not too much to add, other than to say that I am completely satisfied with the performance of my ABS after singling.  As discussed on previous threads, I followed the "put the removed axle's sensors on the remaining axle's wheels and leave them connected to the ABS controller" method (also leaving the air valves connected to the computer, but not connected to air).

My suspicion is that your remaining axle will not have the 2nd sensors mounted on them, so if you want to follow the method I used, you'll need to obtain a couple of new ones.  Unfortunately, I don't know the cost.  The cost of the
new ABS computer however is well known.  It's $1700 list price, and apparently can be had for about $1000-$1100.  There were ABS controllers on sale on eBay a few months ago for $400, but they were not the right part number.  Another member bought one, I believe, but I don't know how it worked out.
Dan

davelinde
27 June 2010
07:55 AM
Thanks all for the advice.  Here's what I've got in summary of the other threads and some prior investigation:

The "reprogram it" route probably doesn't work.  And an idea I'd had to just tie together the ABS controller inputs of the present and missing wheels has been tried and does not work either.  By the way - I've got TCS, which I'll remember to mention as I investigate more since it seems to matter and I'd like to get that feature back too if possible.

The "buy a new controller" route seems to be getting more expensive somehow I had a $600 number for the part and needed to figure out if it was easy to replace (labor = $0) or might need a shop to do it (labor = ?).  Now I see $400 eBay and $1000-$1700 numbers, crud.  However I did get a lead on where to even find this rascal - "It should be a small box attached to the cross member just to the rear of the transmission."  I'll crawl out there and look this afternoon.  The key to doing this right is to know what the right replacement part will be I suppose.

The "add second senders to rear axle" still seems the most cost effective and elegant fix.  However, it just went from "pull the wheels" to "pull wheels AND hub" so I am no longer dismayed to say that task goes to a shop.  But then, it
might be harder to find a shop willing to "rig up" something like this on a brake system.  I think I'd seen a cost of $38 per sensor which sure makes it a cost effective route to pursue.

Rif
27 June 2010
08:10 AM
Check the thread I referred you to again.  The cost of the controller varies somewhat, but mine was $687.  You do not have to have a TCS model, even if you currently have a TCS equipped truck, unless you really need the TCS.  The standard controller without the TCS will fix the ABS issue.  You just won't have TCS.

You could get the number from the photo in that thread.  That controller has worked for two of us.  Of course, that's not to say it will work for every truck but it worked for my 2000 and for Jim's 2003.  To be safe you could just take your VIN to Volvo and have them look up the correct controller for your truck.

Desolation Roe
27 June 2010
08:25 AM
Rif
Would that not get you a six-channel controller again?
Rif
27 June 2010
09:57 AM
If you didn't tell them you want the 4 wheel version.  Some parts guys will work with you and others won't.  The easiest and cheapest way to fix this is to order the controller Jim and I did.  Since it worked on my 2000 and his 2003, it should work on Dave's 2001.
D and J
27 June 2010
10:10 AM
I bought the 400 dollar one on eBay and it is working just fine.

Just to add to all the part number confusion, when I was "playing" with my old 6 channel ABS controller, it looked like the part number sticker was an add on. I took a razor knife, and sure enough there was another sticker under the first sticker with a different part number on the lower sticker!!!

I know it is always nice to save a few bucks, but having the ABS functioning should be corrected at any cost.
Doug

davelinde
27 June 2010
08:05 PM
Dah, I read your thread, then followed a link in your thread and never read the end of your thread.

Sorry to be dense - is $687 a Volvo part or a substitute?  Who did you call to get it looked up and ordered?  Is it easy enough to disconnect and re-install (I see a pdf of a manual which should sure simplify things assuming I can ID all connections right before I take it out.

THANKS for the help and the patience

HERO Maker
27 June 2010
10:13 PM
Dave,
This was Jim's comment about the one he ordered off of that thread:

"Rif ...I called Meritor and told them what I had and they sent the four wheel Module that was a plug and play, I'd get the number off of it but I'm in   Meridian and it's in Retama, maybe you can get Jack to go over and retrieve the
number ....Jim"

This was Rif's comment from the same thread:

"I just heard back from the service writer.  That did the trick.  The quoted price is $687 -- lot's less than I expected."

Sounds like it was the dealer's service writer, but hopefully he'll reply.

Rif
28 June 2010
09:53 AM
Dave,
The $687 was the price I paid.  It is was from Central Valley Volvo in Fresno, CA where I was having some other work done.  They installed it for me but installation is quite simple.  It is just a matter of a couple bolts holding it to
the cross member and plugging in the cable connectors.  IIRC, the cables are unique and will only plug into the proper places, but someone should check me on that.

The only other caution I would add is that the part number Jim and I used is not the same as the one MacDaddy found to be the "correct" one, based on his research with Volvo for me.  But, it works fine and probably will for you
as well.  They made minor changes to these over the years and the numbers changed from time to time.  You know how it works -- you go in to replace a part on your rig and the part they give you has a different number on it than
the original.

davelinde
28 June 2010
04:48 PM
So, I found a local shop that says they can do this for me and I guess I'll get them to quote it.  I also crawled under the truck and found the part - seems like an easy enough R&R - two bolts and 4 electrical connector bundles and the way the wire bundles are dressed they look like they can only plug in one way.

So the $$$'s question that remains is will the eBay part work too.  I found it and visually it's an exact match, described as "new" and with a 2008 QC sticker on it.  I have part number 446 106 074 0 and the eBay part is 446 109 011 0, of course it would not match because mine is a 6S/4M and this is a 4S/4M.
I assume this is the part that others have swapped in with good results?  If I could somehow confirm I've got the right part I'm inclined to just buy it, but I'd hate to buy a $400 box I can't use...

davelinde
28 June 2010
04:51 PM
oh yes... a tangent to hijack my own thread here.

On eBay I noticed air dryer cartridges for sale and while I was under the truck I noticed an air dryer cartridge.  Should I be servicing this on some interval or doing some inspection on it?  I have the manuals and service records on the truck so I can look this up too, just curious though

DJW
28 June 2010
08:24 PM
It was found on our 99 Volvo 770 that the ABS ECM could not be reprogramed after singling so it was replaced with a new ECM part # S446-106-075-0 ECU. It listed for $801.47 and the net cost was $552.95 plus labor to install.
Dennis
davelinde
28 June 2010
09:35 PM
The eBay guy still has them and he just told me "I am just a surplus parts seller and do not have any other information about this Meritor Wabco unit."  Fair enough answer.

Is it safe to assume that since this part worked on 770's it would work on a 660?  This does seem like a good bet to me - but what do I know?  It seems that the key things to line up are that it's the right style (frame mount) and proper re-spec (4S/4M) for my singled application.  After that, hey, what else could go wrong?

renegade warrior
29 June 2010
08:07 AM
I need your help, where on eBay are the ABS controllers found.  Every site or listing I can find is for the Volvo cars and I keep getting no such item when looking for truck items.
thanks Bruce
Jim2
29 June 2010
08:34 AM
Dave
This PDF doc on the Meritor-Wabco web site sheds some light on the Air & ABS sys and the various part numbers for the ECU.  Its a big file, almost 13MB. section 5 covers the ABS.
Jim
On The Road
29 June 2010
08:52 AM
I think this is it.
eBay ABS Controller
davelinde
29 June 2010
08:55 AM
Meritor-Wabco technical support 800 535-5560

A very nice guy named Jeff had me on hold barely 3-4 minutes and confirmed that the part I will need is:  S446 106 075 0 which is superseded by current p/n S446 106 203 0 this will be a plug replacement for me (leaving one connector dangling) including the ABS/ATC function and the "communications type".  This eliminates the eBay guy I found.  So now I've got a service manager at the closest shop to my house investigating a price for that.

This could be a good test, this is a local shop, very close to my house, and just came under new ownership.  If they know their stuff and price fairly they will get more of my work.  Nice to have a project I understand well to start them off.

davelinde
29 June 2010
10:05 AM
The saga continues, (but hey, the hunt is half the fun)

The local shop is new (as in weeks old) and doesn't have the software to check the Wabco ECU.  Now, they probably don't need that for a quick R&R, but you've gotta respect someone who won't accept a job they can't be sure to complete in all situations.  They also offered to quote the part only, but mentioned I might do better ordering directly on-line than their pricing policy will be.

So., I just shot off e-mail to the 3 sources in the HDT resource guide

DJW
30 June 2010
07:28 AM
The S446-106-075-0 part number is the same one that was used on our 99 770 back in 04 when it was singled.
Dennis
davelinde
30 June 2010
07:39 AM
All seems consistent, now I just need to find a source for the part and I'm good to go.  Four e-mail out now.  If that doesn't catch something soon I'll start making phone calls.
davelinde
30 June 2010
03:03 PM
So the eBay link posted prior is what I found too, but it's not the same place others got the right part, and (per Meritor-Wabco tech support) it's NOT the right part for my application.

I just got a quote of $1500 and "out of stock" from Volvo.  I'm thinking that the $5-700 costs people mention are the costs if the part is sourced direct from Meritor-Wabco and not via Volvo?  Just a guess, and I'm still hunting for a source of the part.

HERO Maker
30 June 2010
04:35 PM
Did you ask the tech support guy at Meritor Wabco if they would sell you one?  Again, this was Jim's comment: "I called Meritor and told them what I had and they sent the four wheel Module that was a plug and play."  Maybe Jim used a company name to be able to get it shipped to him?
DonF
30 June 2010
05:23 PM
IF that doesn't pan out for you, the tech. guys at 1-800-52VOLVO might be able to help you; they've provided me FAX/Email excerpts of the appropriate service manuals on a couple different occasions, very responsive, just cannot sell us parts directly.

Of course, they will probably direct you to the nearest Volvo shop that can get the parts --- which might take you back to the HDT resource guide; I've used them (MK in Dakota) for my locking fuel caps.
Good luck!
-Don

p.s. Thanks or the Meritor-Wabco number, I may be needing it for my single-out project.

davelinde
30 June 2010
07:14 PM
Actually I did try to ask - but I was not direct enough maybe..  I said something like "who can sell this to me" and the tech guy said - "oh any parts department that has our parts can order it for you."  If none of my inquiries pan out with a good price I'll call Meritor-Wabco back.  The call screener did start by asking for "account number", when I said I didn't have one he asked "what company are you from" and I said I'm a private owner, he said OK, what city and state and then sent me through.
davelinde
07 July 2010
12:05 PM
Still shopping

So I did get a quote on the Volvo p/n (I assume Volvo just re-numbers the Meritor-Wabco part) at $1500.  After that I kept shopping.  I found yet ANOTHER eBay part that is close, but not the part Meritor-Wabco specs for my singled truck.

I did call MW back and ask if they'd sell me the part.  They won't, but they did confirm it's in stock to be ordered, has a list price of $1900, and can be ordered by their distributors, and they were kind enough to give me a couple local numbers to try.  The closest guy confirmed he can get the part special order - non-returnable for "about 11 or 1200" (so they do discount list a lot).

I put one more call back to MW engineering and had them re-confirm the p/n for my application (I'd hate to buy a non-returnable thousand dollar box that didn't work).  They confirmed it.

I've got one more e-mail out looking for a better price than $1100.  Seems there's been inflation since you all bought yours circa 2004 for $600 or maybe I'm just not finding the right discount retailer.  Getting close though - I do want the ABS and ATC working.  I'm still not up for pulling my wheels and hubs to go the sensor route -- though at $1200 for the new ECU that does get more attractive to try.